how he overcame that, but the spirit that nelson mandela governed in south africa and continued to energy us the still rights movement. when it came to los angeles in 1990, i was there and remember the energy from all the civil rights leaders in this city and other parts of the country. they saw nelson mandela not just as a foreign icon. but they saw him as one of them. so really the inspiration from nelson mandela, his leadership had a profound influence on the civil rights movement. >> i was going to ask you how it was perceived. i know in iconic places around the u.s. where the civil rights movement has significance. there are wreaths laid and tributes paid to nelson mandela. i wanted to ask you how much of them saw him as one of them, not just as a south african leader but one of them struggling for equality? >> that's important when we are trying to position nelson mandela in terms of his historic legacy. when you talk about civil rights organizations and movement in this country. nelson mandela talls -- always, you had a picture. they were the big three, the trinity for civil rights